I think now we are realizing just how truly brutal this schedule has been so far. I'm not sure an easier schedule would not have changed what has been happening to us but I think it has absolutely been the nail in the coffin.
The thing with the schedule--the Norris as a whole has 8 common opponents and 6 games within it. The unique opponents are Bucs/Chefs/Rams (DET), Falcons/Bolts/Hawks (MIN) Panthers/Broncos/Cards (GB). Detroit's 3 are the hardest, but nobody lucked into a Raiders/Jets/Saints slate.
In net points the Lions are +64, GB is +33 and the Vikings are -7. The schedule doesn't seem to be too daunting for the good teams.
The multi-year question is whether playing more bad QBs in years past made the defence look much better than it actually is.
I think I had in mind more the timing and travel parts. Europe and all the weird prime time combos etc. I think KOC referenced it slightly today talking about the Sunday to Sunday schedule being better to get players going who have dealt with injuries (Darrisaw in this case).
Fair enough. The Steelers were on the same schedule prior to that game, though. The Bolts and their MASH-unit OL were also on short rest, after being run over. Good teams have six primetime games a year and make the playoffs.
The Magic's GM once said "we can't win at home and we can't win on the road. . .I just can't figure out where else to play." Absent a game of Madden with injuries off, I don't see a venue or time slot where this roster can look good.
Maybe sell off some of the high priced vets (Allen, Hargraves) that are not key to the future. etc... Maybe try to pick up Assanti Jr (If healthy) for evaluation purposes.
The defense sucking and the ST managing to get a penalty literally every time Price had a good return was just a never ending river of manure... Just so, so ugly
Nobody wants those contracts on Allen and Hargrave. Redmond could get you something, Addison if you’re moving on due the character stuff. Not a lot people are going to want to buy.
Redmond is just on a one year deal, I believe (another terrible move this offseason) so they might have to pay him quite a bit to keep him if he continues to play well. If they’re not going to pay him, his super low salary and level of play should actually get you something decent in return. Hargrave and Allen are expensive, so unless you’re eating salary for the other team, I don’t see anybody being interested. I think they keep Addison too, but that might just be homerism on my part hoping he works out and reaches his potential here.
Pretty sure Redmond`s contract is such that he would be an RFA and we would have matching rights.
1. As for Addison - agreed we do not know if they will give up on him. I doubt it but anybody on the outside is just guessing.
2. Certainly eating salary gets a higher return. But as we have already paid for the signing bonus teams might have interest.
3. Still would like to see them pick up Assanti Jr to see what he has got. Can`t be worse than Okudah (and as my name is Jeff, I have to say the Vikings should never get another 1st round CB with the name Jeffrey. Just does not work out for us.
If Addison isn't going to be extended, it would make sense to trade him while he is still cheap (half of this year, fourth year rookie deal, 5th year option). That's significant value and should get at least a 1st, which can be used to draft another WR.
It's becoming immaterial to say "good teams" when referring to the Vikings, but good teams can't and don't keep everybody--they replenish.
We can debate all day, but it's shockingly simple. Seven weeks of bad QB performance and constantly playing from behind will expose every conceivable flaw. You have competent QB play for just 14/28 quarters and Vikings are another scrappy NFC team like all the rest.
All teams are flawed. Decent QB play covers up a lot of flaws and chronic problems become nitpicks. Over seven games, Vikings only ever forced the Bengals into continuous passing situations because they had the lead, making the defense look a whole lot better. Sure, the limitations of the defense are on display when they're forced to play from behind or constantly make a stop. But that's mainly because they're built and schemed to play mind games and bury a desperate opponent. The're not built like the Browns, for example, whose only hope is to limit scoring and dominate physically. Bottom line, when you can score, your defense looks a whole lot better, and stays fresh physically and mentally to keep you on top.
This DL was built, at considerable cost, to rush the passer. The plan was fine, it was executed abysmally. Redmond has performed above expectations, LDR has performed at expectations, and everyone else has performed below to well-below expectations.
Many online fans love to play GM and cherry pick data to support their grievance with some player, or contract, or playcall. But Occam's razor always wins. For all the analytics, football is often painfully simple. It's especially tempting to point fingers by digging into niche details, when the truth is so obvious but provides fans no agency and no guaranteed solution. It must be this play call, it must be this contract, etc, etc. All fringe concerns. Standing in a burning house while complaining about the AC.
The reality is Defense is very volatile year over year. Schedule also matters. This team will never compete, with its current construction. Have to get younger defensively and pray McCarthy hits.
- GM three years of poor drafts and questionable moves within the draft for just a guy (Turner)
- letting guys walk in FA resulting in
an awful secondary and signing aging DTs to push the middle of the line that haven’t lived up to their contact
-HC who is allergic to the run even when it’s working but can call a trick play to stall a drive during a crucial movement.
I could keep going ad nauseam, all of us are informed fans and see the glaring warts, at least Reichard is still good. This feels like 2018 all over again.
The defensive scheme has to change, the current players are not up to the challenge of running it and the scheme is not adapting to being figured out. There are too many ways to exploit it right now. Two weeks in a row Matellus and a cb are lined up across from a stack and they play it totally wrong for a TD. That is either player error or scheme deficiency but now it's on tape multiple times. Any QB that can move is going to continue to torch this team because they have no solution for it. I hope McCarthy has been resting his arm because it is going to get a workout with all the shootouts incoming.
The bad start killed them -- and they're just not good enough to overcome bad breaks. The good news (for me) is that Addison scored a TD on a prop bet to replenish my FanDuel account and I have Herbert in my fantasy league.
I think now we are realizing just how truly brutal this schedule has been so far. I'm not sure an easier schedule would not have changed what has been happening to us but I think it has absolutely been the nail in the coffin.
The thing with the schedule--the Norris as a whole has 8 common opponents and 6 games within it. The unique opponents are Bucs/Chefs/Rams (DET), Falcons/Bolts/Hawks (MIN) Panthers/Broncos/Cards (GB). Detroit's 3 are the hardest, but nobody lucked into a Raiders/Jets/Saints slate.
In net points the Lions are +64, GB is +33 and the Vikings are -7. The schedule doesn't seem to be too daunting for the good teams.
The multi-year question is whether playing more bad QBs in years past made the defence look much better than it actually is.
I think I had in mind more the timing and travel parts. Europe and all the weird prime time combos etc. I think KOC referenced it slightly today talking about the Sunday to Sunday schedule being better to get players going who have dealt with injuries (Darrisaw in this case).
Fair enough. The Steelers were on the same schedule prior to that game, though. The Bolts and their MASH-unit OL were also on short rest, after being run over. Good teams have six primetime games a year and make the playoffs.
The Magic's GM once said "we can't win at home and we can't win on the road. . .I just can't figure out where else to play." Absent a game of Madden with injuries off, I don't see a venue or time slot where this roster can look good.
Maybe sell off some of the high priced vets (Allen, Hargraves) that are not key to the future. etc... Maybe try to pick up Assanti Jr (If healthy) for evaluation purposes.
The defense sucking and the ST managing to get a penalty literally every time Price had a good return was just a never ending river of manure... Just so, so ugly
Nobody wants those contracts on Allen and Hargrave. Redmond could get you something, Addison if you’re moving on due the character stuff. Not a lot people are going to want to buy.
You would be surprised what teams will do for a short term rental that might get them over the top.
Why would you consider trading Redmond? A cheap young player is the kind you do not let go.
As for Addison, your point is valid but my guess is they want to hold on to him.
Redmond is just on a one year deal, I believe (another terrible move this offseason) so they might have to pay him quite a bit to keep him if he continues to play well. If they’re not going to pay him, his super low salary and level of play should actually get you something decent in return. Hargrave and Allen are expensive, so unless you’re eating salary for the other team, I don’t see anybody being interested. I think they keep Addison too, but that might just be homerism on my part hoping he works out and reaches his potential here.
Pretty sure Redmond`s contract is such that he would be an RFA and we would have matching rights.
1. As for Addison - agreed we do not know if they will give up on him. I doubt it but anybody on the outside is just guessing.
2. Certainly eating salary gets a higher return. But as we have already paid for the signing bonus teams might have interest.
3. Still would like to see them pick up Assanti Jr to see what he has got. Can`t be worse than Okudah (and as my name is Jeff, I have to say the Vikings should never get another 1st round CB with the name Jeffrey. Just does not work out for us.
I certainly don't want those contracts 😒.
If Addison isn't going to be extended, it would make sense to trade him while he is still cheap (half of this year, fourth year rookie deal, 5th year option). That's significant value and should get at least a 1st, which can be used to draft another WR.
It's becoming immaterial to say "good teams" when referring to the Vikings, but good teams can't and don't keep everybody--they replenish.
We can debate all day, but it's shockingly simple. Seven weeks of bad QB performance and constantly playing from behind will expose every conceivable flaw. You have competent QB play for just 14/28 quarters and Vikings are another scrappy NFC team like all the rest.
The QB play is one thing, but doesn't explain/justify the DL, one with that amount of resources allocated to it, getting consistently dominated.
All teams are flawed. Decent QB play covers up a lot of flaws and chronic problems become nitpicks. Over seven games, Vikings only ever forced the Bengals into continuous passing situations because they had the lead, making the defense look a whole lot better. Sure, the limitations of the defense are on display when they're forced to play from behind or constantly make a stop. But that's mainly because they're built and schemed to play mind games and bury a desperate opponent. The're not built like the Browns, for example, whose only hope is to limit scoring and dominate physically. Bottom line, when you can score, your defense looks a whole lot better, and stays fresh physically and mentally to keep you on top.
This DL was built, at considerable cost, to rush the passer. The plan was fine, it was executed abysmally. Redmond has performed above expectations, LDR has performed at expectations, and everyone else has performed below to well-below expectations.
None of that has anything to do with QB play.
Hard to truly evaluate when they're barely getting to do what they're hired to do. Disappointing, maybe so, but very limited opportunity.
Maybe if the defense could stop the run and/or get off the field on 3rd/4th down they might get more opportunities.
Many online fans love to play GM and cherry pick data to support their grievance with some player, or contract, or playcall. But Occam's razor always wins. For all the analytics, football is often painfully simple. It's especially tempting to point fingers by digging into niche details, when the truth is so obvious but provides fans no agency and no guaranteed solution. It must be this play call, it must be this contract, etc, etc. All fringe concerns. Standing in a burning house while complaining about the AC.
“More is required” seemed like the mantra for this season not long ago. “Nut up” is a better way of saying the same thing now.
The reality is Defense is very volatile year over year. Schedule also matters. This team will never compete, with its current construction. Have to get younger defensively and pray McCarthy hits.
Let’s see:
- GM three years of poor drafts and questionable moves within the draft for just a guy (Turner)
- letting guys walk in FA resulting in
an awful secondary and signing aging DTs to push the middle of the line that haven’t lived up to their contact
-HC who is allergic to the run even when it’s working but can call a trick play to stall a drive during a crucial movement.
I could keep going ad nauseam, all of us are informed fans and see the glaring warts, at least Reichard is still good. This feels like 2018 all over again.
The Vikings are welcome to make me eat my words.
This is an an unserious team
You are so right! The offensive play calling is absurd many times and the defense is out of position on nearly every play.
The defensive scheme has to change, the current players are not up to the challenge of running it and the scheme is not adapting to being figured out. There are too many ways to exploit it right now. Two weeks in a row Matellus and a cb are lined up across from a stack and they play it totally wrong for a TD. That is either player error or scheme deficiency but now it's on tape multiple times. Any QB that can move is going to continue to torch this team because they have no solution for it. I hope McCarthy has been resting his arm because it is going to get a workout with all the shootouts incoming.
The bad start killed them -- and they're just not good enough to overcome bad breaks. The good news (for me) is that Addison scored a TD on a prop bet to replenish my FanDuel account and I have Herbert in my fantasy league.
I started McConkey last night, got me 16.2 points in fantasy 😃