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TheDude's avatar

Very interesting stuff.. I saw somewhere that stated the gain that offenses get from going to a bad OL to an average OL is much bigger than going from an average OL to a good OL... Obviously it is not obvious that the youth movement will pay huge dividends this year (though maybe by 2022) but according to PFF the Vikings were #26 last year....Even a jump to 18-20 would be pretty helpful....

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segagenesisgenius's avatar

I think that Klint is an underdiscussed variable when it comes to how this season plays out. We all know that how well our OL performs, whether Dalvin stays healthy, how often GoodKirk comes out to play, and how often BadKirk stays banished to the netherworld will have substantial impacts on how this season goes. That said, as Matthew suggests, each of these may be notably impacted by how Klint manages playcalling. The more that our playcalling is nuanced and keeps our offense out of third and long situations, the better our OL should look. The more we have a light touch with Dalvin, the healthier he should be. The more we use Jefferson short and give Kirk unpredictable playcalling, the better (and more consistently) he should perform. I think that Klint could legit be the difference between, say, so bad as 7 wins this season (if he is a noticeably worse version of his old man that further strains our young OL) or as good as 13 wins this season (if he is a significantly better version of Stefanski), to give the absolute outlier projections. Probably more likely that his playcalling is the difference between 9 and 11 wins, all things equal, but the variance could be even greater.

Also, I'm pretty sure that you have discussed this before (or it might have been a different podcast), but one reason why offenses might run more on 2nd and short is just to give their OL a breather. Teams are passing more than ever before, and every offensive lineman will tell you that it is harder and more taxing and less fun to pass block than it is to run block. If a team has been passing their way down the field, an OC may take the occasion of a 2nd and 2 or whatever to run just to give their OL a break. After all, it makes sense to take advantage of a greater chance to convert (which your stats seemed to show exist) when that playcall also has the advantage of making your OL happy and, potentially, better over the course of the full drive (and/or full game) by giving them a bit of a break amidst a historically-unprecedented passing game.

Beyond that, I agree that all of the things you discussed above would help efficiency, but also points scored and % of drives that end with points don't really measure efficiency. These two just measure, well, points, which are basically by definition flukey and not really static or predictive stat over time. For example, it is basically guaranteed that the Vikings would have extremely poor points scored and % of drives that end with points being as they have the worst starting field position in the league when paired with the worst field goal percentage of the league, both of which are not strongly related to their starting 11 on offense, and both of which they did by wide margins. Specifically, the difference between the Vikings and the 31st place team in the league for FG% was bigger than the difference than the 31st place team and the 28th place team, and the difference between the Vikes and the 31st place team for average starting field position was bigger than the 31st place team and the 26th(!!!) place team.

Also, EPA doesn't really measure efficiency either, but rather EPA is (again) tied directly to the actual points of the game, as the total EPA in any given game is always equal to the actual points scored in the game. Put differently, the total EPA of a team within a game will always be the exact same as the actual score between two teams in a game, as at the end of each game they use history to mathematically apportion the relative effect of each play to the final score. EPA is very valuable and interesting and will tell you a lot, and it is fantastically insightful on a micro level (as it divides out how individual plays can contribute to scoring when compared to the history of the game), but it frankly somewhat less valuable on a macro level, as it is explicitly handcuffed to the score.

If anyone wants to discuss efficiency, they should use DVOA. Incidentally, DVOA still supports all of Matthew's conclusions, which makes sense as they are good conclusions. Specifically, each of the teams in the NFC championship game were top 5 in offensive DVOA last year. Over the last 7 years, only 3 teams that have appeared in the championships game were not top 8 in offensive DVOA (Jags in 2017, Denver in 2015, and Colts in 2014, each of which were clear outliers for various reasons), and the superbowl champ was top 6 in each year but with Peyton's Broncos in 2015 (another objective outlier), as well.

To give an example of how DVOA is better than EPA by comparing two actual plays from last year, let's say that one team scores a touchdown on 1st and goal from the 2 against last year's Steelers (arguably the best defense in the league last year, and one of the best against the run) to go up 14-3 in the first quarter as the Texans did last year, and let's say that another team scores a touchdown on 1st and goal from the 3 against last year's Vikings for a Xmas day present (by then the Vikings were easily one of the worst rush defenses in the league, down basically everyone important in their front 7) to go up 52-33 with less than two minutes to go in the game. According to EPA, it is more impressive and more meaningful for Kamara to score his TD to go up 52-33 with 110 second remaining than it is to run in a TD from 2 yards out to go up 11 against the Steelers in the 1st quarter, because the Kamara TD was one yard further away - in other words, EPA completely ignores your competition and it completely ignores game situation. There are a host of other things that EPA ignores that are meaningful, but this is just one very quick way to illustrate how EPA is a very interesting but objectively pretty blunt tool that lacks nuance, especially when compared to something like DVOA.

If I recall, Coller said in a recent podcast that he was ignoring DVOA because it said that the Vikings had a slightly above-average defense last year before injuries really ravaged the team (they got as high as 9th after week 13 when they had a record of 6-6). Which, I mean that's fine, I guess, but to me it seems like dismissing the entirety of a widely respected stat that is purely analytical because it doesn't match up with your eyes in one instance without even trying to understand why it did so is a curiously anti-analytics viewpoint. I would say it is akin to dismissing PFF grades for all time as dumb and irrelevant because they didn't say that Xavier Rhodes was a top 14 cornerback in the 2017 season, as the eye test clearly said that he was, particularly given his competition that year.

I have mainly stopped trying to get Matthew to reject Football Outsiders and to accept PFF as The Ultimate Truth, but I can't help myself now and again from taking a potshot, if only because I want my three football besties (Vikings, Purple Insider, and Football Outsiders) to play nice. Love you, Matthew!

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